inequality

[Steve]

James: "calling universal health care and public education free stuff is the same as calling a navy aircraft carrier a free ship"

It's probably a good idea to include a source when quoting or paraphrasing someone. This phrase appears to be authored by Jim Wright. The government has the responsibility to provide for the common defense. It does not have the responsibility to ensure everyone has free healthcare.

James: The conservative side often uses the term "handouts" to put a negative feeling on social programs.

The Church also uses the term "handouts" to "put a negative feeling on social programs." [link] [link] etc. etc. etc.

James: Why not choose the thing that works better?

Because it doesn't work better. The Lord revealed this truth to us. Your issues with corporate welfare are a separate issue and can certainly be addressed, but as we know from the old maxim, two wrongs don't make a right.

James: I agree with my friend David Lassiter, a very politically conservative gentleman, that economic inequality is one of the greatest problems facing our country right now.

I agree with President Dieter F. Uchtdorf during this very general conference that "pride" is one of the greatest problems facing our country right now. I also agree with his solution:

President Uchtdorf: Whatever problems your family is facing, whatever you must do to solve them, the beginning and the end of the solution is charity, the pure love of Christ.

The beginning and end of the solution...

James: I think Brigham Young brought many thoughts to Mormonism, including some that are a bit leftist. When I bring them up they are swiftly muscled out, which is sad to me.

They're certainly not muscled out. They're clarified. I love the prophet Brigham Young. I love all of the prophets!

Occasionally we have those who become a law unto themselves in these matters. Sadly, their pride leads them down a road which President Spencer W. Kimball warned us about: “Apostasy usually begins with question and doubt and criticism. …

“They who garnish the sepulchres of the dead prophets begin now by stoning the living ones. They return to the pronouncements of the dead leaders and interpret them to be incompatible with present programs. They convince themselves that there are discrepancies between the practices of the deceased and the leaders of the present. … They allege love for the gospel and the Church but charge that leaders are a little ‘off the beam’! … Next they say that while the gospel and the Church are divine, the leaders are fallen. Up to this time it may be a passive thing, but now it becomes an active resistance, and frequently the blooming apostate begins to air his views and to crusade. … He now begins to expect persecution and adopts a martyr complex, and when finally excommunication comes he associates himself with other apostates to develop and strengthen cults. At this stage he is likely to claim revelation for himself, revelations from the Lord directing him in his interpretations and his actions. These manifestations are superior to anything from living leaders, he claims.”

Almost without exception, as one finds himself or herself walking the road President Kimball just outlined, there will be priesthood leaders who will counsel and advise and even admonish the person. Many heed the counsel, but some do not.

Counseling comes not just for our own benefit but for the blessing of those who might be misled by something we might say or do. I have been deeply grateful to my brethren that they have cared enough to speak to me, on occasion, in plain words.

Surrounded as we are by worldly influences, how can we maintain a sweetness of spirit and a humility that will make us receptive to such counsel? I fear that we have become so enamored with recreation, with fame and fortune, with videos, with television, and with what money can buy that we have little time for eternal things. We cannot take the time to obtain a knowledge of the doctrines of eternity—for that requires sacrifice, effort, and struggle. Furthermore, we have learned to live in a world of clamor and noise and haste and hurry to the extent that we have often become immune to the Spirit of the Lord and the “peaceable things of the kingdom.”

How do we prepare ourselves to be in harmony with the First Presidency and the Council of the Twelve?

On one occasion during the Savior’s mortal ministry, he was challenged by those who were opposing him. They wondered how a person could speak with such certainty without the education of the world.

“Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me.

“If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself.”

We must learn the will of our Father in Heaven by earnest study. Next, we must act upon it. Study alone is not sufficient; we must act upon the words of revelation before we know of a surety of the truthfulness of the doctrines. ...

If we will follow, with diligence, the counsel and instruction that is the united voice of these Brethren, we will know of the doctrine, whether it be of God or whether they speak of themselves.

(Elder L. Aldin Porter, The Revelations of Heaven, October 1994 General Conference) ↗

[Tuly]

Yes, I do remember reading that non fiction book, and like all non fiction books that I read I take from it the things that I agree with and discard the things I don't agree. The part I remember of that book is how we as a society made the choice and continue to make the choice to overwork ourselves not to just exist but to have the things we want - like more cars, bigger homes, toys - or as the author calls it "conspicuous consumption". None of these things are bad but it just means more overwork from us The complete title of the book is The Overworked American: The Unexpected Decline in Leisure by Juliet Schor. Glad you enjoyed the book James, also what do you mean by "But that's the correlation movement and the routinization of charismatic authority has done to Mormonism."?

[Ian]

the term "correlation movement" is commonly used to criticize the church. the term "routinization of charismatic authority" is a reference to the false religious philosophies of sociologist max weber.

[Ann]

In his talk today on opposition, Elder Oaks taught that Satan's plan would have forced "perfect equality." Satan would have us bring people down to make things equal, whereas the Savior has taught us in numerous ways (through His own voice in scripture and through the words of His witnesses) to "succor the weak, lift up the hands which hang down, and strengthen the feeble knees" (D&C 81:5).

In humility and with faith, we would do well to spend our time studying the scriptures and recent General Conference messages. These will help us rise above the fallible philosophies of men and help us gain more faith, which in turn will help us retain an eternal perspective and not be tempted to rely solely on our own reasoning.

[Ian]

we learn from the book of mormon that inequality is caused by sin. see, for example, mormon’s teaching in alma 28:13, “and thus we see how great the inequality of man is because of sin and transgression...”

we also learn from the book of mormon that there is “no way” to bring about equality, except by repentance. see, for example, in alma 4, that alma, “seeing all their inequality, began to be very sorrowful; nevertheless the Spirit of the Lord did not fail him…” and, “he delivered the judgment-seat unto Nephihah…” and, “this he did that he himself might go forth among his people, or among the people of Nephi, that he might preach the word of God unto them, to stir them up in remembrance of their duty, and that he might pull down, by the word of God, all the pride and craftiness and all the contentions which were among his people, seeing no way that he might reclaim them save it were in bearing down in pure testimony against them.”

we also learn from the book of mormon that liberty must be preserved and protected at all cost. see, for example, mosiah’s teaching in mosiah 29:32, “and now I desire that this inequality should be no more in this land, especially among this my people; but I desire that this land be a land of liberty…” see also alma 46.

brigham young exposed false teachings regarding equality and socialism. he taught the gospel of work.

If I were to tell the truth just as it is, it might not be congenial to the feelings of some of my hearers, for truth is not always pleasant when it relates to our own dear selves. You take some of those characters to whom I have referred to-day, who want us all to be of one heart and of one mind, and they think we cannot be so unless we all have the same number of houses, farms, carriages, and horses, and the same amount in greenbacks. There are plenty in this Church who entertain such a notion, and I do not say but there are good men who, if they had the power, would dictate in this manner, and in doing so they would exercise all the judgment they are masters of, but let such characters guide and dictate, and they would soon accomplish the overthrow of this Church and people. This is not what the Lord means when He said: "Be ye of one heart and of one mind." He meant that we must be one in observing His word and in carrying out His counsel, and not to divide our worldly substance so that a temporary equality might be made among the rich and the poor.

You take these very characters who are so anxious for the poor, and what would they tell us? Just what they told us back yonder—"Sell your feather beds, your gold rings, ear rings, breast pins, necklaces, your silver tea spoons or table spoons, or anything valuable that you have in the world, to help the poor." I recollect once the people wanted to sell their jewelry to help the poor; I told them that would not help them. The people wanted to sell such things so that they might be able to bring into camp three, ten, or a hundred bushels of corn meal. Then they would sit down and eat it up, and they would have nothing with which to buy another hundred bushels of meal, and would be just where they started. My advice was for them to keep their jewelry and valuables, and to set the poor to work—setting out orchards, splitting rails, digging ditches, making fences, or anything useful, and so enable them to buy meal and flour and the necessaries of life.

A great many good men would say to me—"Br. Brigham, you have a gold ring on your finger, why not give it to the poor?" Because to do so would make them worse off. Go to work and get a gold ring, then you will have yours and I will have mine. That will adorn your body. Not that I care anything about a gold ring. I do not have a gold ring on my finger perhaps once in a year.

You who are poor and want me to sell that ring, go to work and I will dictate you how to make yourselves comfortable, and how to adorn your bodies and become delightful. But no, in many instances you would say—"We will not have your counsel, we want your money and your property." This is not what the Lord wants of us.

There was a certain class of men called Socialists, or Communists, organized, I believe, in France. I remember there was a very smart man, by the name of M. Cabot, came over with a company of several hundreds. When they came to America they found the City of Nauvoo deserted and forsaken by the "Mormons," who had been driven away. They set themselves down there where we had built our fine houses, and made our farms and gardens, and made ourselves rich by the labor of our own hands, and they had to send back year by year to France for money to assist them to sustain themselves.

We went there naked and barefoot, and had wisdom enough, under the dictation of the Prophet, to build up a beautiful city and temple by our own economy and industry without owing a cent for it. We came to these mountains naked and barefoot. Are you not speaking figuratively? Yes, I am, for it was only the figure that got here, for, comparatively, we left ourselves behind. We lived on rawhide as long we could get it, but when it came to the wolf beef it was pretty tough. We lived, however, and built a fort, and built our houses inside the fort. Then we commenced our gardens, we planted our corn, wheat, rye, buckwheat, oats, potatoes, beets, carrots, onions, parsnips, and we planted our peach and apple seeds, and we got grapes and strawberries, and currants from the mountains. The seeds grew, and so did the Latter-day Saints, and we are here to-day.

President Brigham Young, discourse delivered in the Tabernacle, June 16, 1867, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 12, pp. 60-61

[Steve]

What a helpful find, Ian. Thanks! Here's my latest contribution to this thread:

But in regard to these stewardships, it is not needful or necessary, or the Lord never intended, that every man should possess an equal amount of stewardship with his brother. Why? Because God has given to some men greater ability to manage and control property than others. He may give to one, one talent; to another, two; to another, three; to another, five; and to another, ten; and then command them to make use of these talents according to the instructions and revelations given, and be accountable to Him who gave them.

(Elder Orson Pratt, Consecration, September 10, 1854) ↗

Who owns all the elements with which we are commanded and permitted to operate? The Lord, and we are stewards over them. It is not for me to take the Lord's property placed under my charge and wantonly distribute it; I must do with it as He tells me. In my stewardship I am not to be guided by the mere whims of human folly, by those who are more ignorant than I am, not by the lesser power, but by the superior and wiser.

Those who are in favor of an equality in property say that that is the doctrine taught in the New Testament. True, the Savior said to the young man, “Go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me,” in order to try him and prove whether he had faith or not.

In the days of the Apostles, the brethren sold their possessions and laid them at the Apostles' feet. And where did many of those brethren go to? To naught, to confusion and destruction. Could those Apostles keep the Church together, on those principles? No. Could they build up the kingdom on those principles? No, they never could. Many of those persons were good men, but they were filled with enthusiasm, insomuch that if they owned a little possession they would place it at the feet of the Apostles.

Will such a course sustain the kingdom? No. Did it, in the days of the Apostles? No. Such a policy would be the ruin of this people, and scatter them to the four winds. We are to be guided by superior knowledge, by a higher influence and power.

The superior is not to be directed by the inferior, consequently you need not ask me to throw that which the Lord has put into my hands to the four winds. If, by industrious habits and honorable dealings, you obtain thousands or millions, little or much, it is your duty to use all that is put in your possession, as judiciously as you have knowledge, to build up the kingdom of God on the earth. Let this people equalize their means, and it would be one of the greatest injuries that could be done to them. During the past season, those who lived their religion acted upon the principles thereof by extending the hand of charity and benevolence to the poor, freely distributing their flour and other provisions, yet I am fearful that that mode was an injury instead of a real good, although it was designed for good.

Many poor people who receive flour of the brethren, if they have a bushel of wheat will sell it in the stores for that which will do them no good. My object is to accomplish the greatest good to this people. If I can by my wisdom and the wisdom of my brethren, by the wisdom that the Lord gives unto us, get this people into a situation in which they can actually sustain themselves and help their neighbors, it will be one of the greatest temporal blessings that can be conferred upon them. If you wish to place persons in a backsliding condition, make them idle and dilatory in temporal things, even though they may be good Saints in other respects. If the whole of this people can be put in a situation to take care of themselves, individually, and collectively, it will save a great many from apostatizing, and be productive of much good. I have got to wait for the Lord to dictate from day to day, and from time to time, as to what particular course to pursue for the accomplishment of so desirable a result.

Suppose that we should say that we intend to sell flour at ten dollars per hundred, would that make the people take care of themselves and their grain? It is not so very material what flour costs, nor whether the brethren sell it for three or ten cents a pound, as it is whether each will strive to secure and economise his own provisions. If you establish the selling price of flour at one dollar a hundred, or even at thirty cents, here are some who will sell all they have before night, and then beg their living of their neighbors. What course shall we pursue to produce the greatest good? We have the Gospel and the ordinances of salvation, and if we can get the people to do that which will produce the greatest good, then we shall further promote the interests of the kingdom of God on the earth.

(President Brigham Young, discourse delivered in the Bowery, Great Salt Lake City, Utah Territory, August 17, 1856) ↗

[Steve]

And again:

There is this tendency we have to contend with as a people and as individuals, and it is something we should constantly bear in mind, that God has sent us here and given unto us a mission on the earth, not to accumulate riches, not to become worldly-minded, not to pile up the things of this world which are perishable, to the injury of ourselves or to our detriment in our progress in the things of the kingdom of God. Is it right that we should take care of ourselves as a people and as individuals? Certainly. Is it right that we should be prudent, that we should take care of those gifts and blessings which God has given unto us, that we should husband our resources, that we should be economical, and not extravagant? Certainly; this is right, this is proper, we should be culpable if we were not so. But with this there is also something else required, and that is, to keep constantly in view that the management and care of these things is not the object that God had in sending us here, that is not the object of our probation. God has shown unto this people repeatedly—and there is scarcely an individual member of the Church who has not had experience in it—that he can give and he can take away. I have in my mind now many instances where men of wealth—comparatively wealthy at least—have joined this Church, and it seemed as though there was a succession of events after they joined the Church, to deprive them of all they had, to test their faith apparently, but to show them that God did not give men means for the purpose of placing their affections upon them, and then, after they were stripped, he has, in many instances, begun to bless them again, and allowed them to have means in greater abundance than ever they had before. He has done so with this people. We have been stripped of our property, reduced to the last extremity for food and for other necessary comforts, and yet God has multiplied upon us these blessings when he has sent us food, and we have had abundance. But the happiness of a people does not consist in the abundance of worldly things, that is, the abundance of food or of raiment, or of houses, carriages, horses, and costly apparel. It is true that if we are relieved from the pressure of want, if we have the wherewith to supply our necessities, we feel better, we feel a relief that we do not feel when ground down by poverty. But happiness is not entirely dependent upon these circumstances, as doubtless many of my brethren and sisters have proved. I have proved it myself to my entire satisfaction. I have been in reduced circumstances; been on missions when I did not know where to get a mouthful to eat; turned away by the people who dare not entertain me because of the anger that was kindled against us. I could stand by and weep, being a boy and away from all my friends. But I, nevertheless, was happy. I never enjoyed myself in my life as I did then. I know that happiness does not consist in the possession of worldly things. Still it is a great relief when people can have the means necessary for the support of themselves and families. If they possess these things and the Spirit of God with them, they are blessed. But the Lord requires of us different things in this day to what he did in ancient days. I often think of it.

There is a great deal of inequality among us as a people, not so great as described by the writer in the book of Alma, but still there is a great deal of inequality among us, a great deal of pride and more disunion than there should be. This people are not united as they should be. There are many things existing among us that should be uprooted and not have an existence in our midst. And what is the reason that these things exist? The reason is to be found in our neglect of the principles we have espoused.

(Elder George Q. Cannon, discourse delivered in the 14th Ward Meetinghouse, July 25, 1880) ↗

[Ian]

in general conference last year, elder cook drew a clear distinction between the church and the world.

in the church, our goal is “Christ-centered unity.”

in the world, there is “a major emphasis on divergent cultures and inequality.”

[Steve]

We have a sort of feeling about our own people in our own nation and the nations of the world, that everybody is equal to everybody else. You remember that the Declaration of Independence said, "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

Those phrases seem to have caught the imagination of people of various kinds. I am not going to talk about them, somebody would accuse me of talking politics, but I have this kind of a feeling about them—that they are not intended to suggest that force shall be brought to bear upon me, if I be a law-abiding man, tending my own business, to take away a part of my life to give to somebody else who thinks he would like some of it. I feel the same way about liberty. I feel the same way about pursuit of happiness. That is my right as a member of the body politic, and just because somebody else thinks he would like some of my happiness, I not imposing upon him or taking anything away from him, that I should be compelled to bestow upon him some of my happiness, is just beyond me. ...

Now, I am trying to get out of all this only the one fundamental thought—we were not all equal at the beginning; we were not all equal at the Grand Council; we have never been all equal at any time since, and apparently we never shall be.

(President J. Reuben Clark, Jr., Conference Report, October 1956) ↗

[Steve]

We know that the ills of this troubled world have come about because men have failed to do what the Lord has commanded them. This applies to economic problems as well as to all other ills. We know also that the only cure for them is to do all things whatsoever the Lord our God commands us.

We know that the day will come when “every man” shall share equally in the good things of earth, “according to his family, according to his circumstances and his wants and needs.” (D&C 51:3.) We also know that attaining such equality must await the time when all men willingly work to sustain themselves and, motivated by love for their fellowmen, liberally “impart” of their substance unto the poor and the needy, “according to the law of [the] gospel.” (D&C 104:18.)

It is the responsibility of every Latter-day Saint to work and so impart of his substance, regardless of the shifting standards of this world. We must uphold these principles and oppose every derogation of them. We must be careful not to adopt the commonly accepted practice of expecting the government or anyone other than ourselves to supply us with the necessities of life.

The practice of coveting and receiving unearned benefits has now become so fixed in our society that even men of great wealth, and possessing the means to produce more wealth, are expecting the government to guarantee them a profit. Elections often turn on what the candidates promise to do for voters from government funds. This practice, if universally accepted and implemented in any society, will make slaves of its citizens.

We cannot afford to become wards of the government, even though we have a legal right to do so. It requires too great a sacrifice in self-respect and in political, temporal, and spiritual independence.

Let us work for what we need. Let us be self-reliant and independent. Salvation can be obtained on no other principle.

(President Marion G. Romney, “In Mine Own Way”, October 1976 General Conference) ↗