Self-righteousness

[Betsy]

The Savior loves us too much to leave us as He finds us. He invites His servants to preach the gospel, discern between truth and error, and help our families and neighbors to more effectively follow Him. As we are all imperfect, we do so the best we know how according to the knowledge shared by holy prophets and the guidance of the Holy Ghost.

Okay, where in that list does it say we need to condemn each other? Where in that list does it say to speak harsh judgements towards others? Where in that list does it say to repeatedly tell others they are wrong? Where in that list does it say that we should only read scriptures, and never study anything else? Where in that list does it say to accuse others of "rebellion"? Where in that list does it say to lead by word, and not by example?

I do not believe the Holy Ghost is leading you to argue against me, nor is he leading you to obsessively fight against ideas that may challenge you, but are certainly not wrong. (Especially in politics!) You claim to have a stewardship over us. You probably believe that the things you say are what an apostle of the Lord would say. But you are not fooling any of us. I know I am not a rebel. I know I am not a deviant. I know I am not a dissenter. Yet you keep trying to convince me I am. Is this the Lord's way? Are false accusations really what an apostle would doll out to me, if he were to meet me? Has anyone ever even considered my having stewardship over them? (I would say that I do not have it. My job is to care for and nurture relationships, not to judge everyone. But if your stewardship philosophy is true, clearly you only think that it only applies to you, and that you may exercise dominion over your friends and family).

The insane irony is that we, on huntingtonfamily.org, claim to want to include everyone on the forum, but once somebody comes along that presents ideas they don't like, Ian and Steve work with every ounce of their power to exclude them and to discourage them from participating. Like I have said before, I have never been harsh on someone who wishes not to participate on the forum, because for a long time I didn't, and life was probably better. I didn't have to deal with the vitriol that is spilled out ad nauseum. But at the same time, it is important for me to know who you all really are, and for me to speak my mind. Not just for myself, but for other family members, too. (Even though I was met with a cruel "champion of the downtrodden" misnomer). I know I am capable of being a great listener, and in real life I would love to discuss things with all of my family, but I am smart enough to discern when I am being belittled and judged unrighteously. I reserve the right to ignore that awful influence.

[Steve]

Betsy: Okay, where in that list does it say we need to condemn each other? Where in that list does it say to speak harsh judgements towards others?

Can you please provide me with an example?

Betsy: Where in that list does it say to repeatedly tell others they are wrong?

What would you prefer I say when you publish something that is wrong?

Betsy: Where in that list does it say that we should only read scriptures, and never study anything else?

Can you provide a quote where I said you should never study anything else?

Betsy: I do not believe the Holy Ghost is leading you to argue against me, nor is he leading you to obsessively fight against ideas that may challenge you, but are certainly not wrong. (Especially in politics!)

Betsy, the only reason I engage you on any of these differences is because you log in and publish your false ideas. I don't know why it would be wrong of me to express an opposing viewpoint. If you're merely seeking an end to opposition, you would not continue to post here (or anywhere, for that matter). I really wish you'd attended Elder Christofferson's patriotic service. His counsel regarding the exercise of free speech was very useful.

Betsy: You claim to have a stewardship over us.

Only inasmuch as you have a stewardship over me. We do hold a certain level of responsibility for one another as family members.

Betsy: You probably believe that the things you say are what an apostle of the Lord would say. But you are not fooling any of us.

No. I do not believe that, unless I am posting what an apostle of the Lord does say. And I'm not trying to fool anyone.

Betsy: I know I am not a rebel. I know I am not a deviant. I know I am not a dissenter. Yet you keep trying to convince me I am.

Out of curiosity, what do you think the words "rebel" and "dissent" mean?

Betsy: ...and that you may exercise dominion over your friends and family.

Can you please provide me with an example where I claimed sovereign authority over friends and family?

Betsy: ...once somebody comes along that presents ideas they don't like, Ian and Steve work with every ounce of their power to exclude them and to discourage them from participating.

Can you please provide me with an example where I have used every ounce of my power to exclude you? Also, where have I discouraged you from participating? Is it possible that you may just "not like" my "presented ideas"?

Betsy: I didn't have to deal with the vitriol that is spilled out ad nauseum.

Can you please provide an example of vitriol from your discussion with me?

Betsy: I am smart enough to discern when I am being belittled and judged unrighteously.

I am sorry that you feel belittled or unrighteously judged. As I've proposed a number of times, you could simply read the prophetic quotes and ignore my surrounding commentary. Surely, you don't feel that the Lord's anointed are belittling you or judging you unrighteously. So simply read their words on matters in which we disagree and see what they have to say. At the end of the day, that's all I'm trying to say anyway.

[Steve]

A society where many religions, political ideologies, ethnicities and worldviews coexist under one government is called pluralism. ...

Without an active citizenry, however, pluralism collapses to mere diversity. Differences themselves matter, but engaging those differences matters more. People can disagree and still have productive relationships. ...

Civil society creates public space for people to interact with one another and grow familiar with the unique identities around them. We become smoother by bumping into each other’s rough edges. ...

Communities around the world strive to accommodate diverse ideas, beliefs and cultures without compromising shared values. People acting on their own initiative help make this possible. ... Bridging distances may be hard and will always take courage, but we have no choice but to keep trying.

Our differences have more meaning when they enter into conversation with other differences. Otherwise, we get stuck in our own social cloisters. Creativity suffers in the classroom or town hall when new ideas are barred from discussion. But when we engage with the broader community we discover that we don’t have to resemble others to respect others. ...

Pluralism can work if we are confident enough in our own beliefs to let other people confidently express theirs.

(Mormon Newsroom Commentary, Civil Society: Engaging the Differences Among Us, June 1, 2016) ↗

[Steve]

We have sufficient examples in holy writ to show that it is the duty of every individual child of our Heavenly Father, who has received testimony of the truth, to bear witness unto his neighbors. It is not necessary to go into the world, cross the seas, or into some foreign country to warn another, nor to magnify your priesthood and calling; but it is equally our duty right here at home, here where charity, the love of human souls, can be increased in the hearts of the children of men. ...

We have also in modern revelation, as contained in the Book of Doctrine and Covenants, wherein the Lord says that every one who is warned must warn his neighbor. Does it not appear to you, then, that I am my brother's keeper? An individual who would forsake that responsibility, and partake of the spirit that was manifest by Cain on the occasion that I have mentioned, I tell you that he is not acting according to the spirit of the Gospel, or the word of the Lord. ...

Perhaps I could make you understand what the Gospel means to me when I tell you how I feel when I look into the aged face of my dear old mother, when I comprehend the loving affection that she extended to me in my childhood. When retiring at night she would have me kneel at her side and taught me to pray to my Heavenly Father to guide and teach me in my boyhood days. When I went upon my first mission, she enjoined me in these words: "Always keep your eye on the First Presidency of the Church; where these men lead you must follow." That principle has been burned deep in my nature, by the loving words of that mother.

(Elder Walter P. Monson, General Conference, April 1914) ↗