The Family: A Proclamation to the World

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Ian
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Re: The Family: A Proclamation to the World

Post by Ian »

the proclamation on the family is a revelation from God. of particular importance is what God has revealed regarding gender.

men and women are different. gender is essential to happiness. a man is happiest as husband and father. a woman is happiest as wife and mother. a masculine man perfectly complements a feminine woman. within righteous marriage, a man and a woman together can achieve a level of happiness that can be achieved in no other way.

each of us is either a man or a woman. gender was determined before birth. gender is unchangeable. gender is eternal.

a male spirit is never born into a female body. a female spirit is never born into a male body.

as president boyd k. packer said to the young men in general conference years ago: "From our premortal existence we were directed into a physical body. There is no mismatching of bodies and spirits. Boys are to become men--masculine, manly men--ultimately to become husbands and fathers."

this has always been true. nearly one hundred years ago, elder james e. talmage wrote: "There is no accident or chance, due to purely physical conditions, by which the sex of the unborn is determined. The body takes form as male or female, according to the sex of the spirit whose appointment it is to tenant that body as a tabernacle formed of elements of the earth, through which means alone the individual may enter upon the indispensable course of human experience, probation, and training."

elder talmage further wrote: "Man is man, and woman is woman, fundamentally, unchangeably, eternally."

here is an image of that article in its entirety, from The Latter-day Saints' Millennial Star, published August 24, 1922:

talmage 01.jpg
talmage 02.jpg
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Re: The Family: A Proclamation to the World

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Thanks, Ian! These are great resources, but they do not address instances where Heavenly Father's children are born with intersex bodies—much faith must be exercised by those individuals. Surely, they remain male or female as distinct, eternal beings, but mortality may provide them with faith-demanding challenges in this regard (as we all encounter during this mortal probation).

EDIT: It's curious that Elder Packer's talk is no longer accessible through the General Conference portal or by searching for the title through the site's search function.
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Re: The Family: A Proclamation to the World

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these revelations address everyone. we lack understanding about many things, but God has revealed everything we need to know, including:

only two genders exist in the human family: male and female.

men and women have different responsibilities.

gender is unchangeable and eternal.

there is no mismatching of bodies and spirits.

the proclamation on the family is clear: "ALL HUMAN BEINGS—male and female—are created in the image of God. Each is a beloved spirit son or daughter of heavenly parents, and, as such, each has a divine nature and destiny. Gender is an essential characteristic of individual premortal, mortal, and eternal identity and purpose.... By divine design, fathers are to preside over their families in love and righteousness and are responsible to provide the necessities of life and protection for their families. Mothers are primarily responsible for the nurture of their children. In these sacred responsibilities, fathers and mothers are obligated to help one another as equal partners."

this is simple enough for a child to understand.
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Re: The Family: A Proclamation to the World

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Thank you, Ian. Yes, I understand, sustain, and am grateful for the Family Proclamation. It is, as you said, for everyone.

In reference to my comment about intersex bodies, perhaps we might ask what is meant by being "created in the image of God," and discuss why the things you shared from Elder Talmage and Elder Packer may not paint a complete picture. Obviously, God's body does not exhibit spina bifida, but some of His children's mortal bodies do. God does not have Down syndrome, but some of His children do in mortality.

Lehi teaches us that "men are free according to the flesh, and all things are given them which are expedient unto man" (2 Nephi 2:27; emphasis added). Webster's 1828 dictionary defines expediency as "any means which may be employed to accomplish an end." We know the end to be accomplished is "the immortality and eternal life of man" (Moses 1:39). Therefore, all that is necessary to that end is given to men, but not everything that is eternal is given to men in this life—even that which is necessary may not be granted during mortality. The Lord may (and does) use many means toward the perfect end. There are countless disabilities and physical ailments across a broad spectrum of severity readily seen around the world. These are given to both males and females—indeed, no one is exempt. Does any such condition alter an individual's eternal identity? No. But it will most certainly impact the individual's mortal experience.

Nephi acknowledges this impact in his own life. He employs the same phrase used by his father when he says, "And now, if I do err, even did they err of old; not that I would excuse myself because of other men, but because of the weakness which is in me, according to the flesh, I would excuse myself" (1 Nephi 19:6). The Savior healed those possessed with a variety of ailments, including the young man in Mark 9 whose physical possession caused him to act contrary to the rule of agency. Clearly, there are conditions in this life that reduce the individual to a state that prevents him or her from receiving a complete understanding of—or complete capacity for—perfect agency, making and keeping covenants, etc.

I was struck by this seemingly tangential passage from Elder Orson F. Whitney:
 
Perhaps the Lord needs such men on the outside of his Church, to help it along. They are among its auxiliaries, and can do more good for the cause where the Lord has placed them, than anywhere else. And the same is true of the priesthood and its auxiliaries inside the Church. Hence, some are drawn into the fold and receive a testimony of the Truth; while others remain unconverted — for the present; the beauties and glories of the gospel being veiled temporarily from their view, for a wise purpose. The Lord will open their eyes in his own due time. ...

Again I say, the Lord's Work has need of auxiliaries outside as well as inside, to help it along. Because of their worldly influence — which would depart if they connected themselves with the Church — many are kept where they are, where the Lord has placed them, and can best use them for the good of all.

(Elder Orson F. Whitney, Conference Report, April 1928)
 
Are these individuals to blame for not joining the Church? No. They are only free according to the flesh, and the flesh has been made to forget for a time. President James E. Faust also touched on this subject in reference to those with disabilities:
 
How are the works of God manifest in these, our handicapped brothers and sisters? Surely they are manifested greatly in the loving care and attention given by parents, other family members, friends, and associates. The handicapped are not on trial. Those of us who live free of such limitations are the ones who are on trial. While those with handicaps cannot be measured in the same way as others, many of the handicapped benefit immensely from each accomplishment, no matter how small.

(Elder James E. Faust, The Works of God, October 1984 General Conference; emphasis added)
 
We must be careful in assuming that the Lord only works according to our own rational prescription. Returning to the specific issues of this recent thread, I remain convinced that it is possible for a soul to be unaware of his or her eternal identity because of conditions or limitations present in their bodies. I cannot judge this. Their temporary mortal plight may really be intended to serve those around them—you and me! Whether we're referring to someone whose mortal phase lingers in a vegetative state or otherwise, I know that they do exist as a male or female and that their physical bodies will be restored to the extent that all will be able to arrive to a knowledge of things as they really are.
When God can do what he will with a man, the man may do what he will with the world.     ~George MacDonald
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Re: The Family: A Proclamation to the World

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Well, I am no expert in these things, but agreeing completely with Ian's comments, along with all the revelations put forward by the Church, I offer the following thoughts.

Children who are born with "intersex" bodies are still born with a spirit that is either male, or female. There are no "intersex" spirits.

The gender of our spirits cannot change. Therefore, a female spirit born into such a body is still a female, and a male spirit born thusly is likewise still a male. The mortal body, being a temporary vessel if you will, is not the ultimate determiner of gender - it's the spirit within. Nothing that happens to the body can change that eternal nature.

I opine that parents who are faced with the challenge of raising a child born into an unusual, exceptional circumstance such as an "intersex" body must do as all parents who have special-needs children must - seek the Lord's guidance in prayer and faith, with much fasting, trusting that the Lord will provide the answers they need to raise the child according to its true, eternal nature and gender. I believe that a father, blessing such a baby, is entitled to revelation and the use of the power of the Priesthood to discern which blessings to give his new child, whether they be blessings meant for a male, or a female, spirit. I do not believe parents are ever asked to raise a baby "it," nor that the child's gender could ever be a matter of choice. However a baby comes formed into the world, the spirit comes with an eternal gender already inherent to its divine nature, and the burden of the parents is to seek the Lord's guidance to understand which gender defines their child.
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Re: The Family: A Proclamation to the World

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Correct. There are no intersex spirits. The gender of our spirits cannot change. And I'm not sure anyone in the discussion believes in a baby "it" or that gender is a choice???

Edward, I think what Ian is arguing, noting that this thread is an extension of a conversation we initiated while we were together in California, is that a physical body always perfectly mirrors the spirit's identity without exception. As a rule, that is the case, but I am not so sure there are not exceptions. And I'm convinced that not every spirit in mortality is aware of their eternal identity due to physical influences.
When God can do what he will with a man, the man may do what he will with the world.     ~George MacDonald
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Re: The Family: A Proclamation to the World

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"gender is an essential characteristic of individual premortal, mortal, and eternal identity and purpose."

setting aside the premortal and eternal components of this statement, consider what it says about mortality. gender is an essential characteristic of individual mortal identity and purpose.

gender is of great importance during mortality. no physical or spiritual circumstance can alter that fact.

why is gender important during mortality? gender is essential to identity and purpose.

as a man, my identity is this: i am a son of God. my purpose is to become like Heavenly Father.

to become like Heavenly Father, i must obey his commandment to marry and have children. i must fulfill family responsibilities according to my gender.

the proclamation on the family is all about responsibility. "HUSBAND AND WIFE have a solemn responsibility to love and care for each other and for their children.... By divine design, fathers are to preside over their families in love and righteousness and are responsible to provide the necessities of life and protection for their families. Mothers are primarily responsible for the nurture of their children. In these sacred responsibilities, fathers and mothers are obligated to help one another as equal partners.... WE WARN that individuals who violate covenants of chastity, who abuse spouse or offspring, or who fail to fulfill family responsibilities will one day stand accountable before God.... WE CALL UPON responsible citizens and officers of government everywhere to promote those measures designed to maintain and strengthen the family as the fundamental unit of society."

rather than focus on responsibilities, the world focuses on rights and entitlements. significantly, we find just one reference to entitlement in the proclamation on the family: "Children are entitled to birth within the bonds of matrimony, and to be reared by a father and a mother who honor marital vows with complete fidelity."

men and women have different family responsibilities. "disability, death, or other circumstances may necessitate individual adaptation," but abdication of these responsibilities has calamitous effects during mortality.

as a man, my happiness during mortality depends in large part on the fulfillment of male responsibilities.
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Re: The Family: A Proclamation to the World

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Yes, and baptism is also essential in mortality. There are many things that are essential in mortality. But not everyone will have the opportunity to pursue and/or enjoy those essentials during mortality.

And yes, as men, you and I both have essential roles to fulfill here. We should not abdicate those responsibilities. We cannot judge whether all men and women enjoy the same privilege in this life.
When God can do what he will with a man, the man may do what he will with the world.     ~George MacDonald
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Re: The Family: A Proclamation to the World

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the challenges of mortal existence do not make gender any less essential.
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Re: The Family: A Proclamation to the World

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Agreed.
When God can do what he will with a man, the man may do what he will with the world.     ~George MacDonald
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Re: The Family: A Proclamation to the World

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President Oaks spoke of three fundamental doctrinal truths that God has revealed:

First, … that God created ‘male and female,’” and that this “binary creation is essential to the plan of salvation.”

Second, modern revelation teaches that eternal life, the greatest gift of God to His children, is only possible through the creative powers inherent in the combination of male and female joined in an eternal marriage (see Doctrine and Covenants 132:19). That is why the law of chastity is so important.”

Finally, the long-standing doctrinal statements reaffirmed in [The Family: A Proclamation to the World] 23 years ago will not change. They may be clarified as directed by inspiration.” For example, “the intended meaning of gender in the family proclamation and as used in Church statements and publications since that time is biological sex at birth.”

...

“Because we love God and understand His great plan of salvation and the significance of His commandments, we manifest our love for our neighbors by helping them come unto Christ, repent, and keep His commandments. This is part of bearing one another’s burdens that they may be light.”

(General Conference Leadership Sessions Begin, October 2, 2019)
When God can do what he will with a man, the man may do what he will with the world.     ~George MacDonald
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Re: The Family: A Proclamation to the World

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this is great. i would love to see the full transcript. president oaks used the word "binary" to describe God's creation of male and female. the world uses words like "non-binary" and "genderqueer" to describe God's children. president oaks affirmed that eternal life is only possible through marriage of male and female. the world permits "gay marriage." president oaks confirmed that gender means biological sex at birth. the world defines gender as a social construction.

with all the false ideas and vain philosophies floating around, we are blessed with living prophets and apostles. they are chosen by God. president oaks is speaking the truth. God's children are either male or female. marriage is between man and woman. gender is not fluid. there is no spectrum between male and female. eternal life can only be achieved by fulfilling male or female responsibilities.

the family proclamation states that gender is an essential characteristic of individual premortal, mortal, and eternal identity and purpose. some people believe that their gender is eternal, but that they were born into the wrong body. president oaks confirmed that the intended meaning of "gender" in the family proclamation is "biological sex at birth." biological sex at birth is an essential characteristic of individual identity and purpose during mortality. that is the truth.
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Re: The Family: A Proclamation to the World

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As I was cleaning out the clerk's office in our meetinghouse, I found a pamphlet authored by President Spencer W. Kimball, providing the following insights:
 
Homosexuality certainly is a leaky cistern. It means waste of power, an end to the family and to the civilization. ...

One young man sought to pit his reasoning against the things I told him, saying, "That is your opinion and this is mine." This caused me to say, "My dear boy, if it were my opinion against yours, I would have nothing more to say. As an individual my mind might be dull compared to yours; my thoughts might be elementary compared with your erudite ones, but you have forgotten a basic truth. I am not expressing my thoughts only. When I say this is sin, I am quoting the Creator of the world. Truth is truth and needs no eloquent tongue nor brilliant brain to portray it. You are using the logic of one mind, however keen it might be; I am expressing the truths of God as interpreted by six thousand years of the Lord's prophets in addition to the Lord, himself, the Christ, the Savior, the Creator, the Redeemer. Why do you continue to 'kick against the pricks'?"

If ten million rationalists combine to find out a truth, they can never, worlds without end, find a truth unless they follow the path of truth. If they parallel the Lord's truth with their own, that is excellent. But if they counter the Lord's basic truths, the more they rationalize, the farther they will get away on the diverging lines. ...

Then I said to this young man, "You are brilliant. Use your brains to think and ponder and explore but never presume 'to counsel your God' and don't presume to call black white just because you think it so. Do not presume to change vital, basic eternal truths. The truth is truth regardless of all accumulated opinions arrayed against it. Sin is sin, the devil to the contrary. Rationalizations cannot change it." ...

Pure logic also outlaws this practice. The world cannot survive through this ugly practice. Imagine, if you can, the total race skidding down in this practice like Sodom did—no more marriages, no more children, no more family life—just one generation of gratification of lusts and the end. Imagine, if you can, the whole society accommodating its standards to this low level: the lawmakers rescinding laws against such sin, the public sentiment accepting the perversion so that neither judge nor jury nor law-enforcement officers could protect society. Can you imagine the voices of the ever decreasing righteous being stilled, and the ever increasing volume of those who love and live the lie? Where would the world go if such a practice became general? The answer: To the same place other unbridled civilizations have gone. If you have thought that down the line to its certain conclusion, you have Gomorrah and you have Sodom. Rome, Jerusalem, and Babylon followed, and London, Paris, and Chicago are in their steps. ...

Many men in this practice, conditioned against marriage, have used as excuse that marriage has failed. Certainly, numerous marriages have not measured up. Divorce has proved the weakness and selfishness of man. But even if 99 percent of all marriages failed, the principle is still right, for as Paul said, "Neither is the man without the woman, neither the woman without the man, in the Lord" (1 Cor. 11:11). ...

Homosexuality had gone "underground" because of social pressures, but is now trying to impress the public to make this vicious sex life acceptable. Society as it degenerates might skid down the hill toward acceptance of the sin, but the Lord and his true Church will never condone these sexual sins. ...

False counselors have no love for you but want only what you might be able to do for them. If such persons have convinced you that this way of living is not degenerate, then they are likely degenerate themselves and are in reality your worst enemies. ...

Even if your partner in sin should be a psychiatrist, a medical man, a psychologist, and if he teaches that these immoralities are harmless, he is either deceived or a vicious deceiver. Shun him. ...

You may deny God in words and in actions but you can never erase him from your soul, having once known and testified numerous times of him. You may deceive yourself and rationalize that life is for fun and sex and pleasure and gratification of the baser desires, but you will never totally believe it down deep in your heart. ...

You also know deep in your heart that the Church and the Lord have no ulterior motives—the only desire being for the restoration of you, yourself, a son of God, made in his image. ...

What can be compared to your losing your Church membership, your priesthood, your blessings, your soul? They might never be restored to you. Men who die may live again, but when the spiritual death is total, it were better that such a man were never born.

(President Spencer W. Kimball, A Letter to a Friend, 1971 (revised 1978))
When God can do what he will with a man, the man may do what he will with the world.     ~George MacDonald
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Re: The Family: A Proclamation to the World

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thanks for sharing that. feels good to read the truth, while so many in the world are talking nonsense now.

society has skidded a long way down the hill since that was written. we passed "acceptance" a while ago. we have arrived at "celebration."

glad that he singled out "psychiatrists," "medical men" and "psychologists." too many of them are promoting sin in the name of "science."

nothing compares to losing church membership. we need the church. without the church, we lose our family forever.
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Re: The Family: A Proclamation to the World

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Right, Ian! President Nelson reminded us of this recently when he cautioned:
 
The spirit in each of us naturally yearns for family love to last forever. Love songs perpetuate a false hope that love is all you need if you want to be together forever. And some erroneously believe that the Resurrection of Jesus Christ provides a promise that all people will be with their loved ones after death. ...

So, what is required for a family to be exalted forever? We qualify for that privilege by making covenants with God, keeping those covenants, and receiving essential ordinances. ...

I understand why God weeps. I also weep for such friends and relatives. They are wonderful men and women, devoted to their family and civic responsibilities. They give generously of their time, energy, and resources. And the world is better for their efforts. But they have chosen not to make covenants with God. They have not received the ordinances that will exalt them with their families and bind them together forever. ...

They need to understand that while there is a place for them hereafter—with wonderful men and women who also chose not to make covenants with God—that is not the place where families will be reunited and be given the privilege to live and progress forever. That is not the kingdom where they will experience the fulness of joy—of never-ending progression and happiness. Those consummate blessings can come only by living in an exalted celestial realm with God, our Eternal Father; His Son, Jesus Christ; and our wonderful, worthy, and qualified family members.

(President Russell M. Nelson, “Come, Follow Me”, April 2019 General Conference)
When God can do what he will with a man, the man may do what he will with the world.     ~George MacDonald
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