This is not a discussion about whether or not edited films are ok.
This is not a discussion about immoral content (or any other content).
This is not a log of what movies we watch and their effects.
Address each question presented, one at a time, and do not stray from the specific question.
Comments which do not address the specific question in concise format will be deleted or moved.
R-rated films will be defined as movies that are rated 'R' by the MPAA for public release in theater and video.
We're trying to come to a conclusion about R-rated films. It was getting very difficult in the past thread, because there were far too many issues being discussed (which were inherently off-topic, since the thread's issue was actually editing films).
As moderator of this particular thread, I will be moving in step-by-step fashion through the issues, ONE QUESTION AT A TIME. It should be much clearer and systematic in this fashion. If you prefer not to participate according to the rules, you are encouraged to pass on this discussion. This is not a thread to share feelings about general topics. It's not about winning or losing an argument. We are members of a family trying to choose the right, so we're going to talk about right and wrong. We are going to focus on specifics--one at a time. Please keep your responses as BRIEF as possible.
QUESTION #1: What is a commandment?
Last edited by Steve on Thu Oct 12, 2006 2:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
When God can do what he will with a man, the man may do what he will with the world. ~George MacDonald
i should add, i'm not sure if people will want to go along in this way... it might seem too compulsory. maybe we need to let the discussion develop naturally rather than force the issue... i'm not sure... am i looking at this the wrong way?
Nobody need be scared of this discussion. The point of my moderating this is not to manipulate the discussion toward some decisive victory. I think part of the reason many of us disagree on this issue is because we have different perceptions of the elements that form it. So we're simply going to go through each element, one by one, to understand where the disagreement lies.
The goal is to foster clearer, specific communication. We all love each other and want to do what our Heavenly Father desires, since we all know that's the only way to be happy. So no personal jabs, no back-biting...we're all family here. Let's keep this simple and meaningful.
UPDATE: I'm more than willing to make this discussion more open if that will get more involvement, I just think there needs to be WAY better structure. As it stood, people were posting speeches and only responding to general thoughts, not specific, important details. Plus, with 10-15 different subjects included in the debate, there was no focus whatsoever. Most every debate/discussion has a moderator to help keep people focused and to limit their time (or length of response). At least this way, we all go step by step.
When God can do what he will with a man, the man may do what he will with the world. ~George MacDonald
Beh! You've gone and posted something new before I posted a promised response at the other thread.
Frankly I think this whole thread here can be zapped. There is nothing new in this. Zero new information. All this has been said before. I thought the other thread was just fine - freewheeling and unbounded and exploring things from every angle.. or the same opposing angles repeated redundantly ad infinitum. The utility of that is it says, I _REALLY_ believe this, as opposed to potentially falsely or unemphatically before. Please allow me to be EXTRA EMPHATIC. I'm all for that.
This just throws me all out for a loop. I thought I made a lot of ground in the other thread and seems somehow now null, as if we need to start over? We don't. And I'm shortly continuing at the other thread. Just kill this one. Zap the whole thing. That's my vote.
well, can we kind of continue the discussion from the other thread in here? it's true that the other thread was supposed to be about editing movies with clearplay, etc. this can be the thread about r-rated movies in general.
can we try to go along with steve's framework? or do we need another/alternative thread where we can be more freewheeling, etc., like alex suggested?
it's important to have threads that stay on topic, so that other people can follow along if they want to. and if a thread gets out of hand, it's hard for people to keep up.
Yeah, Ian. I don't know. I was just trying to think of a way to discuss this in depth, without everybody trying to play all the cards at once. I don't mind having an open discussion, but the previous thread was just turning into a "raise a new issue without addressing the last comment" slash "make a jab about a comment from a whole other thread" slash "try to word my response in as clever a fashion as possible, mwuahaha" slash "I'm not listening, la la la" approach.
Step-by-step moderation seems strict, but is it? We'll be talking about the exact same things, just in a more structured format. Open format is ideal, but I think it's apparent that it was turning into a hodge-podge of ideas with no focused attempt to stay on topic. Edited films kept making it into the discussion, though it had shifted to R-rated films, and then R-rated viewers were claiming that PG-13 are just as bad as if we were discussing content, etc. etc. etc.
So like you, Ian, I'm not sure what is wanted. I do know that half the debate left the building when I suggested inspecting this issue on a microscopic level. That's kind of telling.
When God can do what he will with a man, the man may do what he will with the world. ~George MacDonald
Steve said: (not sure how to do the quote thingy)
"half the debate left the building when I suggested inspecting this issue on a microscopic level. That's kind of telling"
Yeah, kind of telling that un-arbitrated-chaotic-backstabbing-discussion forums are more fun than ones with rules. Lol (I'm just joking).
I know I've only been on for 2 days, but I think I'm already burning out. I really was more interested in the edited R film topic anyway (and kept trying to remind folks that that was the original topic of the forum). And I guess we all have a pretty firm idea of what a commandment is, and that Pres. Benson commanded us not to watch R films...so this topic will no doubt end with Steve victorious (nor do I think I feel any differently than the direction this thread seems headed? Well--maybe I will, though? hmm...)...but what about EDITED R films?...
Circles are fun! (It brings a Strongbad song about spinning in circles to my mind...)
Last edited by Lili on Thu Oct 12, 2006 8:23 pm, edited 4 times in total.
"I feel strongly that the visual arts are of vast importance. Of course, I could be prejudiced. I am a visual art!"
-Kermit the Frog
Lol. More fun, but less productive. Since we're discussing a serious issue, we were trying to avoid making light of it. As far as edited films go, I think both sides of that debate have been pretty fairly spun during the first 5-6 pages of that thread. If there are additional thoughts on the matter, I recommend you post them in that thread. This topic was just moved here because it's another important issue that was raised in the latter part of that discussion (and I think it needs resolution).
And I'm not trying to be "victorious." I want truth to be victorious.
When God can do what he will with a man, the man may do what he will with the world. ~George MacDonald
by the way i think there's a balance between having fun and being "productive," so to speak. people enjoy this forum differently (some are more serious than others, etc.). we just need to try not to waste the time of others with excessive silliness, pontification, and stuff like that. it takes a long time to read all this stuff!
Lol (I'm just joking).
And I'm not trying to be "victorious." I want truth to be victorious.